Houston19514

And this matter of street quality is something that has been objectively studied... Of the studies I've seen, there is no support for the "opinion" that Houston's streets are the worst in the world or similar hyperbole that we often see here. The most recent study I've seen was of metro areas over 500,000 and Houston was solidly in the middle of the pack.

It will be a bit disappointing if they can't get the residential part to work out. But at this stage in the development of downtown, at least for this particular development, I think the retail is FAR more important, and exciting. That is especially so if the Finger apartment tower goes up as planned.

Hey, largeTEXAS, any chance the Pavilions can go forward without the residential component?

If the two apartment towers aren't going to work, maybe they should ditch at least one of them and drop in a hotel or hotel/condo (the original plan included a hotel; Through the first 7 months of 2006, downtown hotels ran at 70% occupancy, a large jump over last year; If that growth continues, the market would be more than able to handle new entrants by the time construction would be completed. ). W Hotels comes to mind...

I have never understood how it is such a "problem" explaining that Houston has tall buildings in places other than downtown. While Houston's may be taller and bigger than other cities', it is not all that unique in this respect. NYC has midtown, downtown, and Brooklyn, skylines (plus suburban skylines). Chicago has tall buildings outside of the Loop. LA has tall buildings outside its downtown. Washington DC has skylines downtown, Arlington, Tysons Corner, etc. Atlanta has downtown, midtown, Buckhead, etc. How many times have Dallas trolls listed their multiplie "skylines" on this board? For crying out loud, even Oklahoma City and Tulsa have tall buildings (some even in groups that could be called a skyline) outside of their downtowns.

I'm guessing you don't get out to other cities very often. As I posted earlier, my impression when I visit Houston is that the roads overall are in quite good shape. Hence, the bad ones are especially noticeable (e.g. Kirby south of 59, which is scheduled for a complete re-do soon I believe).

It's really just a matter of mathematics. During the past five years, the Atlanta CSA has been growing at average of 133,000 per year, while the Houston CSA has been growing an average of 108,000 per year, according to the Cnsus estimates. IF we assume that those trends will continue for the next five years (ie., that Atlanta continues to grow by 25,000 each year MORE than Houston grows), the Atlanta and Houston CSAs should be essentially tied at the time of the 2010 Census, and Atlanta would overtake Houston shortly after. (This of course ignores the Katrina-induced boost in Houston's population and any additions to either area's CSA (such as a possible addition of Beaumont-Pt Arther to Houston's CSA.)) Do you have a source for the statement about Atlanta's slowing growth?

any updates on Victory Tower?

The Houston MSA (the official Census Bureau name is "Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown") consists of the following counties: Harris Chambers Fort Bend Galveston Montgomery (which includes The Woodlands and Conroe) Liberty Austin Brazoria San Jacinto Waller The Houston CSA (the official Census Bureau name is "Houston-Baytown-Huntsville") includes all of the MSA counties listed above, PLUS Matagorda and Walker counties (which brings in Huntsville) Neither Beaumont/Pt Arthur nor Bryan/College Station are included in either the MSA or the CSA. The 2005 population estimates were as follows: MSA: 5,280,077 CSA: 5,380,661

Jason, you are correct that the estimates are pretty straight-forward and unvarying. Houston is indeed the 7th largest MSA (D-FW is 5th) and the 10th largest CSA (D-FW is 8th). At current trends, Atlanta CSA will not pass the Houston CSA until JUST after the 2010 census (of course one or both of the ATL and HOU CSA's may be changed geographhically by then, throwing all projections out the window). Houston will probably have passed Detroit when they release 2006 numbers. FWIW, if current trends continue, after the 2010 census, I would expect the top 5 MSA's to be NYC, LA, Chicago, D-FW, Houston. Acknowledging that it is indeed little more than opinion, I have to disagree that there are 5 "big cities" in DFW and more than 1 in the Houston metro. In my opinion, the only "big cities" in D-FW are Dallas and Fort Worth. All the others, no matter how big their population, are essentially suburban in character and will never have the central cores that could arguably make them "big cities" in themselves. Likewise, the only "big city" in the Houston metro is Houston.

When I see these posts claiming that Houston's streets and roads are all in horrible condition and the freeways are all strewn with litter and trash, I wonder if the posters are in the same Houston I visit often or if I perhaps have been accidentally going to the wrong city. Sure there are some bad streets, but the interesting thing to me is that, when I'm in Houston I particularly notice when I'm on a bad street, because the vast majority I encounter are quite good. The same with the freeways; In the time I lived there and in the many many visits since, I have never seen a freeway that was particularly dirty or noticeably strewn with litter or trash. And I especially pay attention to these things when I visit, because after reading the comments on this board, I begin to wonder if perhaps I have been missing something all these years. Sure, there are some bad streets in Houston (show me a city about which that cannot be said), but it is beyond ridiculous to say that the only smooth road in all of Houston is the five-mile stretch of Allen Parkway/Kirby.

I guess you missed my point. Perhaps, if you had also lived cities #1-11, you would understand why they are 1-11 and Baltimore is 12. Without similar exposure to the cities, one is really not in a position to determine.

Have you also lived in the each of cities # 1-11?

Trying to find the possible locations... in looking at yahoomaps, the only vacant parcels I see in the immediate vicinity of Allen Center are immediately north of West Dallas St., on either of the street that runs from Allen Parkway from/to Clay and Polk Streets.

LOL Well put, Gary.

Jason, Jason, Jason. . . The only "6 million person DFW metro estimate" that the Census Bureau has made is indeed the CSA (Combined Statistical Area), which, as you concede does include Sherman/Dennison [sic]. D-FW CSA estimated population as of July 1, 2005 (the latest available): 6,171,301 D-FW MSA estimated population as of July 1, 2005 (the latest available): 5,819,475 You can get to all of the estimates from here. I know, I know, the North Texas Council of Governments or some such group has put out their own "estimate" above 6,000,000, but as you also know, the geographical area covered by that estimate is not the same area as is covered in the Census Bureau's definition of the MSA.

Is that the former Tenneco parking building/cafeteria/gym?

The Woodlands, Galveston, Sugarland, Brazoria, and Baytown are already included in Houston's Metropolitan Area population. The inclusion or exclusion of cities and counties are determined by commuting patterns, etc. by the Census Bureau. You can find a full, sleep-inducing definition of the methodology at www.census.gov (FWIW, Sherman/Denison have recently been added to the D-FW Consolidated Metropolitan Area. Houston's CMA also includes Huntsville; I would think Beaumont-Pt Arthur-Orange would be added to Houston's CMA in the not-too-distant future)

Lord & Taylor closed all of their stores in Texas, and quite a few others as well. Bad management that couldn't decide what kind of store they wanted it to be...

I think one of the new structures on the west side of the TMC has many floors of parking with something like 4 floors of research and office space on the top. Could that be what he is referring to? (and now that I think about it, the TMC McGovern Common Building is primarily parking, with retail/restaurants on the bottom and office and restaurant space on top...)

1500 Louisiana was the tallest of the four new downtown towers No and no. As the article stated, the building would be on one of two vacant parcels of land acquired by the company when it purchased Allen Center. I don't know exactly where those are, but they are clearly not the church parking lot (because it is owned by the church and was never part of the Allen Center properties) nor is it where the Sheraton is (because that is not a vacant property and also was never part of the Allen Center properties). You left off 1400 Smith, which is now part of Allen Center (Allen Center IV), but Continental Centers I and II, 500 Jefferson, KBR Tower and 1500 Louisiana are not part of Allen Center. Continental Centers I and II, 500 Jefferson, and KBR Tower are all part of Cullen Center, which I believe Brookfield also purchase. 1500 Louisiana is neither part of Allen Center nor Cullen Center, nor was it purchased by Brookfield. It is owned by Chevron. I don't believe CBD vacancy rates got as high as 23% last year (Collier's shows a 2nd quarter 2005 vacancy rate of approx. 20%), but in any event I believe the article stated that they would not proceed until they have a large portion pre-leased. The overall market occupancy is really not directly relevant to a new project. All they need is to have their building leased. For a perfect example of this, look at the Dallas market, with substantial new construction while their market has one of the highest vacancy rates in the country. (Of course the market is indirectly relevant because high vacancies put downward pressure on leasing rates etc etc.) And, the really important factor now might be the availability of large blocks of Class A space. With the recent removal of the huge blocks in 1400 Smith, 1500 Louisiana, and Continental Center I, there probably aren't very many large blocks of space available. Anyone have information on that?

Oh, for crying out loud, give the constant negativity a rest. I frequent boards such as this for several different city and NONE of the others come close in the level of NEGATIVE posts regarding the subject city. What is wrong with posting some FACTS about Houston that just happen to be positive?

As shown in your posted photos, the park is not forcing McKinney and Lamar to abut Walker and Dallas. Those streets have been like that for many many years.

I have a feeling we'll all be better off if you stick to the parks near you. ;-) Nobody is going to try to force you to go to Discovery Green.

Hmmmm... putting in massive permanent infrastructure upgrades designed to attract (re)development where there is little, like midtown or North Main. I have an idea! HMaybe we could try a light rail line.